Episode VII

Bucho wrote:

Did the PT challenge the OT? Or did they just challenge the fanfic novels?

All the EU stuff at the time was pretty strictly forbidden to do anything with the Clone Wars era. The original Marvel comics run dipped into a little; it had an Obi-Wan solo story set during the Old Republic era (but of course at the time nothing firm about what the Clone Wars actually were and when they happened had been established), and there was an annual that specifically mentioned Obi-Wan having visited a planet with two apprentices, Vader and Luke's father (oops).

If the PT "challenged" anything, it was 22 years of speculation as to what the Clone Wars were (most people thought they were fought against clones, not by them; some even speculated Mandalorians were clones) and the assumed amount of time that had passed between the fall of the Old Republic and Star Wars. And there was a lot of grumbling about not actually seeing the Clone Wars onscreen after all this time. But nothing that came close to the levels of toxicity aimed at TLJ. If anything, prequel apologism was in full effect.

Oh yeah, how did I forget about the midichlorians!?!

As someone who witnessed the backlash against the PT first hand even I was taken aback at the level of unwarranted vitriol TLJ got.

Headless Fett wrote:

Bucho wrote:

Headless Fett wrote:

I think when you're younger and are deep into the canon of a particular IP you are openly hostile to anything that changes or challenges it. Of course this assumption got tossed into the garbage compactor when the Prequel Trilogy came out and then many years later with the Sequel Trilogy.

Speculative fiction in print and in various media has been successful because it has changed along with society's views and values. Nobody wants the same stagnant story beats recycled ad nauseum, outside of a very vocal and small minded minority of course.

Did the PT challenge the OT? Or did they just challenge the fanfic novels?

That combined with the preconceived canon that fans had been building in their heads since ANH.

Midiclorians didn't go over well with some people let me tell you.  

Not to mention the Jedi - who the OT had everyone believing for years were these flawless beacons of power-fantasy heroism - suddenly turning out to be, well, a bunch of dicks, really. A baton that Johnson was all too happy to pick up.

Personally, I fucking love TLJ. That kind of questioning of the canonical status quo is what I wanted to see out of new Star Wars. I even appreciated the slow chase as a new angle on space warfare in SW. Some of the complaints, I understand: while I like how the Canto Bight section is about Finn learning about the wider universe, in service of helping become the hero he needs to be - and thanks, JJ, for completely dropping the ball on that one - it does go on a bit long.

What I've never had patience for is all the knee-jerk whining about 'problems' that are addressed in the film itself, that flew over some people's heads. I've never seen a film with so many 'flaws' that could be fixed just by actually fucking watching it.

Worky, you old pirate!

Workyticket wrote:

That kind of questioning of the canonical status quo is what I wanted to see out of new Star Wars. I even appreciated the slow chase as a new angle on space warfare in SW.

I don't really get this. Logically the slow chase made no sense, while also being glaringly inconsistent with the other films. As a 'new angle on space warfare' it doesn't work - it's dragging out something that (I think) is meant to be exciting to the extent that it becomes not exciting, bordering on a parody. My interpretation is that it's a "thing" that was done primarily so they could attach the other two story lines to the movie - while being able to bring them all together for the finale. So it feels very artificial.